Indie Interviews
Today I'm happy to introduce you Clemens Scholz, a talented product designer and developer. Together with his friend Florian Schulte, they found Vogelhaus Apps where they build Peaks and Macaw. Peaks is very interesting app that offers valuable insights into your body's circadian rhythm, a scientifically supported daily cycle that exerts a significant impact on your sleep, energy levels, and overall productivity.
Get a prototype out there as soon as you can and gather feedback
Can you tell us more about yourself and what led you to become an indie maker?
Both of us, Clemens and Florian, have backgrounds as Product Designers in large corporations, where we built apps used by millions. We learned how to design apps, and when SwiftUI was released, we wanted to learn how to build them. This led us to start our first project, Macaw.
Macaw started as a personal project, serving as our hands-on coding tutorial. Our ideas are born out of a need we both experienced. During the pandemic, we were looking for a simple solution to track expenses, especially take-out food. Macaw was that: a simple way to track expenses, which over time evolved into a functional application that people around the world now find valuable.
Working on Macaw got us hooked. We loved it so much that we decided to go full-time indie with our latest, much more ambitious project, Peaks.
How did you come up with the idea? How do you generate ideas for your apps or projects, and how do you identify the problems or needs your app can address?
We share a notes file where we constantly jot down all sorts of ideas. When a particular idea piques our interest, we discuss it with each other and with friends.
The idea for our latest app, Peaks, originated from this note-taking process and personal curiosity. We had observed that we consistently felt tired at the same time every day. Intrigued, we conducted research online and soon discovered the science of the circadian rhythm — this is your body's internal clock, which dictates when you feel tired or energized.
We started exploring whether we could use data from Apple Health to decode someone's individual rhythm. We built numerous prototypes, combining Apple Health data in various ways, until we were confident we had something viable.
When we discussed the concept with friends and family, we quickly got a lot of ideas about how we could build features around that rhythm. People were curious and found the insight the app provided valuable. Their responses affirmed our decision to develop the idea further, and we started iterating on the app.
In general, we enjoy engaging in conversations as they help us identify areas for improvement. This can be overwhelming, as there are many ideas, so we keep track of these as a list in our notes. When deciding what we want to build next, we focus on what brings the most value to people.
How does your day-to-day app development workflow look like?
Since it's just the two of us, our app development workflow is fast and dynamic. We focus on building and testing quickly. Once an app progresses beyond the initial prototyping phase, we aim to work in two-week cycles. We track our releases in Linear, a tool we absolutely love. Even though we operate at a fast pace, we find it crucial to stay organised in our planning.
Given that we're both designers and developers, ideas can transition smoothly from design into code without the need for extensive handoffs.
In terms of communication, we hold daily standup meetings each morning and schedule planning sessions in sync with our two-week cycles. Once a week, we hold "office days", which are our in-person meet-ups. We use these days to film content for our social media channels and tackle larger topics.
Since developing an app and building a business demand a lot of time and dedication, we also try to prioritise our friendship. We make a conscious effort to engage in non-business activities whenever we can – one of our favourites is going for walks.
How do you launch and market your app?
With Peaks, we initiated a soft launch to ensure that everything runs smoothly. Whenever we launch a new feature or app, we notify Apple, in hopes of catching their attention for possible features in the App Store.
Since our budget doesn't allow for any paid advertising, we rely on organic digital marketing. We aim to regularly post videos about our current work on Instagram, TikTok and LinkedIn, hoping to gradually connect with a like-minded audience. We've found that videos are more effective, as they offer a straightforward way to demonstrate what our app does.
We've also published a few blog posts on our website and plan to create more in the future. These posts aim to provide more in-depth information about certain features and topics related to our apps. Not only does this help improve our website's SEO, but it also offers a peek behind the curtain.
What are the future plans for your app?
Thanks to people's feedback, we have plenty of ideas for the future of Peaks. Currently, we are investing our efforts into building the first widgets for the app. With these, we aim to provide our users with instant, glanceable, and relevant information about their rhythm.
Over the next few months, we're developing Peaks Plus, a premium version of Peaks with additional features. This project is particularly exciting for us, as we're looking forward to offering our users even more ways to interact with and benefit from Peaks.
Looking further ahead, one of our goals is to create a version of our app for WatchOS 10. We believe this platform is perfect as the watch is able to track all the data we need to calculate people's energy forecast effortlessly. We are also looking to add exciting new features for iOS 17 and iPadOS later this year.
Do you have any interesting lessons learned or tips for other indie makers?
One of the most crucial lessons we've learned is the importance of testing early. It's easy to fall in love with your idea and start perfecting it before it's been validated. The truth is, no matter how great an idea seems in your head, it may not work in reality. So, get a prototype out there as soon as you can and gather feedback.
Failure is part of the process. We learned this with a project we called Dodo, an app that would grant you screen time as you complete habits. While testing the idea, we learned that it is not feasible.
Whenever you launch a new app or a significant update, let Apple know about it. They're always on the lookout for new apps to feature in the App Store, and getting featured can be a massive boost to your visibility.
Lastly, don’t be shy about talking about your app. Discuss it with your peers, post about it on social media, write blog posts, participate in forums - the more people hear about your app, the better.
Looking back, are there any decisions or actions you regret not taking before or during the development and launch of your apps? Is there anything you would have done differently?
Looking back, there are a few things we might have done differently. One of our main reflections is that we wish we had quit our jobs sooner to focus on our indie projects. Balancing full-time work with app development on the side significantly lengthened the time it took to get our projects off the ground.
With Macaw, we learned that testing early and often is crucial. If we were to start over, we would definitely put more emphasis on validating our ideas with users at every stage of the project. This approach would have not only saved time but also ensured that we're always on the right track.
Are there any other products that you are particularly proud of? Could you share some details about them?
We'd love to mention Macaw, our budgeting app. We're particularly proud of this project as it was our first step into the indie development world.
Macaw was born out of our personal need for a simple, yet effective way to manage our finances. We wanted an app that gives us an overview of our expenses at a glance, provides insights into our spending habits, and holds us accountable. This is exactly what Macaw does.
Are there any indie makers or creators whose work you admire and follow closely?
We love to follow other indie makers like David Smith, Klemens Stracher, Curtis Herbert and David Jöch. We take great inspiration from them and the community.
Could you recommend any specific tools or resources that you believe are helpful for other indie makers, especially those just starting out?
When it comes to learning coding, we can't recommend Design & Code enough. Their 'Learn Swift' course was particularly helpful in getting us off the ground with Swift.
Another resource that we found extremely beneficial is “100 Days of Swift" from Hacking with Swift. This course offers a comprehensive, structured approach to learning Swift and is perfectly tailored for beginners.
Finally, we cannot stress the importance of Apple's WWDC videos enough. These are a gold mine of information about development and design straight from the Apple teams themselves. Watching these presentations not only helps us to stay up-to-date, but also provides valuable insights into how Apple envisions their platforms and technologies being used.
Thanks for reading til the end. Hope you enjoy the interview as much as we did. Below are some useful links mentioned throughout the interview
- Vogelhaus
- Clemens Scholz
- Florian Schulte
- David Jöch
- Curtis Herbert
- David Smith
- Design Code
- 100 Days of Swift
- WWDC Videos
Indie Interviews by Indie Goodies is all about discovering and showcasing indie makers. We firmly believe that behind every app, there's an inspiring tale of passion, creativity, and perseverance. We're always on the lookout for aspiring indie makers to feature in our series, and if you have any suggestions or recommendations, we'd love to hear from you.
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